Il2 Cliffs of Dover Blitz and Tobruk - News and updates

[Boo]

3 hours ago, kestrel79 said:

They are really good at announcing content...but we still have been waiting for a release of one of them for a long time.

I know it's an all volunteer group and it will take time, that's fine I'll be patient.

This is the issue though. We all say "I'll be patient" when sometimes we actually mean "I wont play it until". Eventually "until" starts to turn into "ever". Everyone has different reasons for not playing it now. No VR, No VU, bad AI, missing menu functions, no decent MP scene, no squads, etc. And over time people drift off and forget they were waiting in the first place. Perhaps not us, but we are not the vast and silent majority. 

There needs to come a point where the long awaited evolution is not always just around the corner. A point where what you get is what you got - like it or lump it, play it or dont. I think many are pinning on Dieppe to be that moment - I really hope it is. But what if it isnt? What if its Blitz with a B17 and the same AI and trees? 

I fearl that too many big ticket things are starting to back up into one another and that those things that have now become the final dealbreakers in terms of how many keep faith.

In the meantime, CloD sits there usued despite actually not being a bad way to whittle away the hours at all but damned by the eternal promise of jam tomorrow. 

 

 

[Mysticpuma]

New update from Buzzsaw regarding the B-17 external model:

"Hello All

The B-17E external and damage models are complete.
It has been placed in the queue for import into the game.

Cockpits and turrets are well underway... images will be part of a later update.
Images are from 3dsMax viewer and do not include in game shadowing and reflection effects.

https://i.ibb.co/phzgwmk/promo-063124-1.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/Q9xqc7n/promo-063124-2.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/GRMP3gF/promo-063124-3.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/ky8wK6D/promo-063124-4.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/LQHDWjK/promo-063124-5.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/Vw2hPwP/promo-063124-6.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/NZYbPSX/promo-063124-7.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/7VvJHqx/promo-063124-8.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/0VHXVWG/promo-063124-9.jpg

It will be human flyable... full pilot/bombardier/turrets except waist gunner positions, (no one uses these as they are very difficult to hit with and also require a huge amount of 3d modeling) and no Radio/Navigator positions.  (these have no functional use in the game)

[Trooper117]

Fantastic stuff... well done to the team. The bomber fans will have a B-17 at last!

[Jaguar]

The "useless" navigator argument is non-sense. What about night bombers then? Sounds like the havies will be just targets for furballs in cristal-cleat skies...

[Enceladus]

2 hours ago, Jaguar said:

The "useless" navigator argument is non-sense. What about night bombers then? Sounds like the havies will be just targets for furballs in cristal-cleat skies...

Well then how about you model the Navigator station.

[Feathered_IV]

I’d rather be able to hit Ctrl N or something and be able to ask the AI navigator for a course to target or the next waypoint etc. much better than being a one man band and having to run all over the aircraft to get things done. Especially when there’s no auto level or other way to hold the aircraft’s attitude.  

[Boo]

14 hours ago, Jaguar said:

The "useless" navigator argument is non-sense. What about night bombers then? Sounds like the havies will be just targets for furballs in cristal-cleat skies...

We'll have to see how TF intends to implement radio navigation and/or AI interaction I guess. If they are looking at radar then it follows they can expand to beam systems. You can already take an 88 or 111 to target blind in certain scenarios. I hope its more than simply "look outside and compare"

Even so, I cant help but wonder what people will be satisfied with bombing wise. Taking a 1941 bomber over the continent at night will require some very creative thinking about what a successful raid lookslike. A bomb within 5 miles or hell to historical accuracy and pickle barrel every time? 

11 hours ago, Feathered_IV said:

I’d rather be able to hit Ctrl N or something and be able to ask the AI navigator for a course to target or the next waypoint etc. much better than being a one man band and having to run all over the aircraft to get things done. Especially when there’s no auto level or other way to hold the aircraft’s attitude.  

This wold be an good solution for most provided the AI isnt bot like in its accuracy all the time. There is potentially a missed trick in mp multicrewing but im thinking being put in the nav seat is something akin to being the last one picked for a school football team or only being alowed in the band on the condition you agree to play bass. 

[Feldgrün]

 

On 7/8/2024 at 8:07 PM, Boo said:

There needs to come a point where the long awaited evolution is not always just around the corner.

You didn't even mention the issue of whether the promised changes appear when promised. That's another reason folks lose faith in that game.

There have been a lot of changes to CloD since its initial introduction, but the underlying problems remain the same. I fear that more aircraft and more maps won't really make a significant difference in the number of players.

On 7/9/2024 at 1:46 AM, Mysticpuma said:

New update from Buzzsaw regarding the B-17 external model:

... no Radio/Navigator positions.  (these have no functional use in the game)

No Radio/Navigator gun positions? I'm not sure how effective they were, but the lack of these gun positions leave gaps in the B-17's defenses.

Edited July 10 by Feldgrün

[Boo]

6 minutes ago, Feldgrün said:

No Navigator gun position? I'm not sure how effective it was, but no cheek turret leaves a gap in the B-17's defenses.

There is perhaps potetial to keep them AI or model the gun element of the position only? 

Who knows. 

[Boo]

8 minutes ago, Feldgrün said:

 

There have been a lot of changes to CloD since its initial introduction, but the underlying problems remain the same. I fear that more aircraft and more maps won't really make a significant difference in the number of players.

 

 

Yup

[Jaguar]

12 hours ago, Enceladus said:

Well then how about you model the Navigator station.

Of course I can understand budget and modelling restrictions. But flagging the navigator position as useless in a sim that plans a strategic bombing title on a huge map doesn't sound good to me.

[Boo]

 

 

Its a WIP but gives perhpas some idea of Truesky. I am less convinced by other aspects and there clearly remains much work to do.  

 

 

Edited July 10 by Boo

[Feldgrün]

21 hours ago, Jaguar said:

Of course I can understand budget and modelling restrictions. But flagging the navigator position as useless in a sim that plans a strategic bombing title on a huge map doesn't sound good to me.

If I'm flying a bomber, I'd rather not be the navigator & bombardier as well as the pilot, unless I wanted to. Otherwise, I'm just a huge fighter-bomber. Functional AI positions are a weakness in many sims.

Edited July 11 by Feldgrün

[Boo]

I still think that the whole strategic bombing thing is just not suited to combat sims and what most people want out of them.  Ultimately none of these types will be used in that role by anyone but a small number of people in SP but are likely to be enjoyed more by many finding other uses for them.

 Its a USP in the fact the aircraft are there to fly but not necessarily operate true to history. Enough to be an engaging experience within the bounds of the sim. Im ok with that. 

Edited July 11 by Boo

[Feldgrün]

2 hours ago, Boo said:

I still think that the whole strategic bombing thing is just not suited to combat sims and what most people want out of them. 

I'm interested in B-17s as targets for the FW 190s. I'm Ok with just an AI bomber, like in DCS.

[DBFlyguy]

Personally, I'm glad someone is finally doing a heavy bomber, AI is great, playable is even better!  Kudos to the CloD team doing what the GB team is unwilling to do.

[Boo]

I dont really care about all the new stuff. I just want my saturday afternoon MP furballs over the Solent back. Most fun Ive had in any sim looking back 🙂.

I wonder how many of those players would reappear once the VU is in place? 

Edited July 14 by Boo

[kissTheSky]

1 hour ago, Boo said:

I dont really care about all the new stuff. I just want my saturday afternoon MP furballs over the Solent back. Most fun Ive had in any sim looking back 🙂.

I wonder how many of those players would reappear once the VU is in place? 

I may show up if VR update shows up (ever). I’ve never played CloD. Purchased it to support TF while they worked on VR as soon as they announced Tobruk along with VR. Not an action I will care to repeat.
Not complaining, just that I see their “kickstarter” effort on VR a failure and don’t care to support another failure. 

[Boo]

12 minutes ago, kissTheSky said:

I may show up if VR update shows up (ever). I’ve never played CloD. Purchased it to support TF while they worked on VR as soon as they announced Tobruk along with VR. Not an action I will care to repeat.
Not complaining, just that I see their “kickstarter” effort on VR a failure and don’t care to support another failure. 

I think my memories are more based on the people I played with and against. That interaction will always be more important to me than tech, no matter how immersive. At least in the case of Clod. I do understand your position however. 

Perhpas one Saturday afternoon eh?  🙂

[kissTheSky]

29 minutes ago, Boo said:

I think my memories are more based on the people I played with and against.

Oh, I knew that. I was just trying to say, once the never ending beta of VU is concluded, there might be new players having waited on the wings, no pun intended, for so long.

[Boo]

4 minutes ago, kissTheSky said:

Oh, I knew that. I was just trying to say, once the never ending beta of VU is concluded, there might be new players having waited on the wings, no pun intended, for so long.

Regardless of its state when i get back to simming, I'll give Clod a fair go even if it means sitting on an empty server for a month. Hopefully, I think Ive pissed enough cheerleaders off over the years for at least some of them to come have a crack at me from time to time 🙂 

[wheelsup_cavu]

6 hours ago, kissTheSky said:

Purchased it to support TF while they worked on VR

 

I purchased Clod when it was first available at the Great Battles store even though it still requires Steam to play. I did not know if @Jason_Williams got any dough from those purchases but I figured if he got enough sales through the GB store it might help him in his dealings with upper management when it came to who knew his customers better. 

 

Wheels

[Feldgrün]

On 7/14/2024 at 8:36 PM, wheelsup_cavu said:

 

I purchased Clod when it was first available at the Great Battles store even though it still requires Steam to play. I did not know if @Jason_Williams got any dough from those purchases but I figured if he got enough sales through the GB store it might help him in his dealings with upper management when it came to who knew his customers better. 

I also bought CloD through the GB Store page, along with a bunch of collector planes. I spent hundreds of dollars trying to help GB out at the time (I've given up since).

[kestrel79]

I bought CloD day one. I think I may have even got a boxed version? Man what year was that. I think my boxed version "cd" pretty much took me to Steam and just installed it there anyways. I can't remember.

But with the really poor UI (still an issue today), and the last minute tacked on epilepsy filter that cut fps in half it was not a good launch. 

I'll gladly add it back to the ssd when they get VR in there and get it all patched up. I'll be patient. I still think it can be a good sim. It has good bones. Just takes time with a volunteer dev team.

[Feldgrün]

2 hours ago, kestrel79 said:

I'll gladly add it back to the ssd when they get VR in there and get it all patched up. I'll be patient. I still think it can be a good sim. It has good bones. Just takes time with a volunteer dev team.

I'm all for being patient, but it seems like the focus of the team is creating more planes & maps, not fixing the AI & UI issues which, in my opinion, are the real problems with the game.