Plans for Cockpit interaction ??

[ACG_Jackman]

 

Question?

On the Stormbirds interview Jason said his aim is to "quote" to usher in a new hardcore combat flight-sim series" , will the aircraft have Full Fidelity Cockpit like DCS models or Non-Full Fidelity like IL-2 Great battles or in the middle like Cliffs of Dover??.

For me the interaction and flight management of my aircraft is important and adds to the realism. 

What do others think?

 

 

[Yogi]

That is very tricky.

Being able to jump into action without the hassle to click every button before starting the engine is a great time-saver on some occasion (fast brawling with fellows), while it can be very enjoyable when you are in a "full-sim" mode - I would really like to be able to have both indeed.

The cheat-buttons ala DCS would be great so as to take the desired route at will.

[BlitzPig_EL]

Agree Yogi.  Keep the sim open to many play styles.  

The more players, the greater the chance of success for all of us.

 

 

[Trooper117]

11 minutes ago, Yogi said:

The cheat-buttons ala DCS would be great so as to take the desired route at will.

Yes, you can start the aircraft in DCS that way without going through the whole procedure, it would be good to incorporate that idea if possible... 

[Blue 5]

CLoD, IIRC, had quite a good half-way house whereby you could follow a historical start procedure but the engine had been - realistically- primed by the ground crew. That I recall as a satisfactory approach.

Is it too early to start the ‘engine timer’ debate?

[dburne]

I thoroughly enjoy and much prefer the full fidelity cockpits of DCS. WWII birds you are only looking like around 5 min to get started up , taxi to runway , and in the air. 

To me ideally a good combat flight sim would offer both, cold start and runway engine running start to capture most everyone in that category of features. However neither would be a deal breaker for me as long as the sim is really good.

Edited May 19, 2023 by dburne

[LuftManu]

I think that the important element here is not clickable pits but systems and system interaction. If the team wants to add a good depth to systems, I guess clickable pits will be easier to add.

 

Apart from that, I can see that this can be done in a way that doesn't cost too much time to have accesibility:

 

If you press E, the startup is done automatically.

If you want, you can do it also manually.

 

Same for some things on the cockpit like change fuel tank in usage and various things 😃

 

 

[thegrim1]

Having both would be interesting. 

I I found myself playing a lot more IL-2 because I could just simply throw on my VR headset and hop in a sortie online or off quick and easy. 

While I do like DCS I don't always have the time or frankly the focus to deal with full fidelity. But I very much do like it.

Sometimes I just wanted to get in a war bird and do some dog fighting or jabos runs. 

"Hop in and go" in il-2 was also made possible by the much better quick mission system and online communities like TAW and combat box. 

 

 

[Ribbon]

For me clickpit is a NO feature if it goes at the cost of variety of gameplay and content!

Even in dcs i mostly use clickpit only at the startup so i hope they will focus on good gameplay and variety of content as it was in old il2:1946...id raher have fighter, torpedo bomber and bomber than only fully fleshed fighter. I hope they wont go dcs path

[Flyingscotsman]

I tend to use autostart, and then taxi out,(time constraints) ok its not far in a carrier. Absolute precision in the cockpit, ....not really, IMHO if it flies CLOSE to the numbers, great, the aircraft model should look good/great. But as there are no flying KI-61 Tony's , I'd accept whatever the manual said it could.

Hopefully the AI will not be crewed by dead eye dicks (IL2-1946 - B24 gunners) or unreal flying capabilities. IL-2 BON P-51 Leaves my ME-262 standing! lol

[spreckair]

I am one who does not need a clickable cockpit.  Using a mouse to click and manipulate controls just is not immersive to me when I am trying to fly like a WWII combat pilot.  But I do get that there are many who would like to operate the entire set of controls visually.

[Hoss]

If you stop to think, we didn't actually push, pull, turn, everything in the cockpits of IL2. BUT, you did have to sit there and watch it, so what's the difference?  And another,.... but.... we didn't have to arm guns, bombs, rockets in IL2 either. Most servers did not make you wait on engine warm ups, but that is when I set up my weapon/ordnance systems. For me that is very immersive. You are going to have to wait for your turn on the cat anyway.... everyone forget about that?

[Axurit]

For me in VR on DCS when I start my plane it's the moment when I "get into the skin of the pilot" It helps my immersion.
And it only takes a few seconds.
 On IL2 the start is the moment when I watch the navigation.

On Combat Pilot when we find ourselves a little ten days from the flight deck before takeoff, I think that the immersion will be all the greater by starting manually.

In VR handtracking is making progress, and when the game comes out more progress will have been made. It would be a shame not to be able to take advantage of it on a game where VR will be native.

[Baldrick]

I believe these discussions will mostly be with enthusiasts who have some kit to map buttons and levers to and also see multiplayer as the predominant game play.

What we are are unlikely to hear from are all those who play DCS or IL2:BoX SP quick missions with either a basic joystick or dare I say it a keyboard and mouse. As a proportion of sales my guess is this is much higher than we might think.

Hopefully the survey will help but even that won't pick up more casual guys who will pick it up after release seeing an ad on Steam or in a FB feed etc. Casual doesn't necessarily equate to arcade mode and clickable cockpits is a must IMHO. These guys may be what makes the games viable to make for the hardcore (pure speculation of course!)

Personally I prefer to map as much as I can to my HOTAS, button boxes and quadrants so I want great flexibility in control mapping.

[spreckair]

@Baldrick  I agree with your post, and it was what I was trying to express earlier.  I would like to see all controls useable, but I don't need to click on them with a mouse.  I would much rather find a way to map them to tactile buttons/quadrants instead.

Edited May 20, 2023 by spreckair
correction

[Hoss]

19 minutes ago, spreckair said:

@Baldrick  I agree with your post, and it was what I was trying to express earlier.  I would like to see all controls useable, but I don't need to click on them with a mouse.  I would much rather find a way to map then to tactile buttons/quadrants instead.

In DCS I start the Engine with the mouse.... couple of switches and knobs, bingo bango..... engine started.... I won't need to touch those controls again, so all my axis and buttons are free to map things I need to take off, execute mission and land. WWII birds are not as big a HOTAS button hog as the DCS jets..... so guys with a conscious about their money will play this game like a boss with just a TM 1600, Saitek, etc.....

[spreckair]

@Hoss I kind of do the same thing in IL-2; I use VoiceAttack for the one-off activities (as well as the non-flying actions and for commands to AI pilots), and save the buttons and levers for the actual flying.

Edited May 20, 2023 by spreckair
correction

[Ohka]

I would gladly take the IL-2 GB approach if it means a fuller roster.

Foregoing click able cockpits is fine with me if it makes the difference between getting an iconic plane or not. It may also make a lot of difference in pricing and marketability.

After all, I personally think the appeal of this game will be mastering dogfighting and the ability to plant a bomb on a maneuvering ship rather than knowing where the magneto switch is on each plane.

[JG1_Vonrd]

Although I usually use the "quickstart" button in DCS I find having the clickable buttons available in cockpit very useful. For some complex aircraft, mapping and memorizing all of those controls to HOTAS gets confusing when switching from aircraft to aircraft. Much more intuitive to reach over to the cockpit control. Given, WWII aircraft don't have the plethora of controls like the modern jets (so, maybe not as big a deal to incorporate clickables into this sim?) I still would like to click on cockpit controls. 

[HerrMurf]

I'm all for switches being animated and having a realistic manual startup and shutdown. I don't see click pits being necessary with a modern HOTAS though.

Just my opinion.

[IckyAtlas]

I am not really for point and click switches. Have them animated yes. I prefer to have an animated pilot body in the cockpit and not an empty cockpit.

And in VR I suppose that to have a pilot body in the cockpit would be even better.

Let's now dream a little. When you are in expert mode and do the full procedure to startup the engine then when you hit the key for the radiator or switch on the electric power on, prime the engine switch fuel valves etc. etc. then it would be fantastic! to have the animated pilot arms in the cockpit go and press the right switches corresponding to what we did. And if you hit one key in simplified mode to do an automatic engine start then you would have the pilot body arms go automatically through the whole process. Awesome, that would be AWESOME!

This would really bring the sim to a higher level.

 

[Semper Fi]

Isn't clickable cockpit part of a modern flight simulator ?

For me it's like VR, complex engine management ect.

Don't forget that IL2 GB does not have this option because game's engine is based on RoF. No need to click everywhere in a WWI plane.

[Gambit21]

On 5/19/2023 at 5:04 AM, dburne said:

 

To me ideally a good combat flight sim would offer both, cold start and runway engine running start to capture most everyone in that category of features. However neither would be a deal breaker for me as long as the sim is really good.

Those are both mission design, not simulation design.

[VARP_Kroat]

A cool feature would be if a player could explore the aircraft carrier and walk around the flight deck and around the planes. I would prefer something like that over the full clickable cockpit.

[javelina]

1 hour ago, VARP_Kroat said:

A cool feature would be if a player could explore the aircraft carrier and walk around the flight deck and around the planes. I would prefer something like that over the full clickable cockpit.

gotta admit, that would be cool to do.